Comments on: At a Crossroads

By: smalldog

smalldog — Tue, 01 Sep 2009 18:00:32 +0000

Seraphine, your comment (25) resonated with me. I’ve also felt the stretch of being tugged one way by church culture/practice, another by the church itself (not at all the same thing as the first example!), what I felt were god’s expectations for me, any my expectations of myself. It’s vicious being a thinking reasoning woman and feeling utterly betrayed by the very things you believe are there to support you, it makes you question your identity in the most fundaamental ways. All I can say is that maybe it’s not your relationship with God/Church/Culture/Whatever that you’re struggling with, it could be your relationship with yourself; ie your own goals, expectations, frustrations, hopes, etc.
I didn’t know how to make being a feminist, a woman, a Mormon, and all the other things I wanted to be mesh. Then I realized I was trying to make them mesh in other people’s eyes. I realized I couldn’t trust God until I trusted myself first. Trying to figure out the will of a Being that is infinite and eternal is too complex, but figuring out MY will (sometimes an equally tough challenge) was a lot more manageable. And in my eyes, even though things may not add up, I don’t have to defend any aspect of myself to anyone at all. Least of all God.
I think that 9 times out of 10 we DON’T find answers or peace. We don’t hear about those stories in the Ensign or at sugery happy RS meetings, but it’s still the case. And that’s not the Mormon Condition, or the Female Condition, that’s the Human Condition. The point, if we have faith of any kind at all, is to fight through it anyway. Continue to challenge what feel to be wrong, defend that which feel to be right, see the faults of even good things with a clear eye, take a break when the slog becomes hard, and pick up again when we’ve rested enough to continue.
I hope you do find answers and peace, but even if you don’t, I hope you always have that bravery that characterizes you and allows you to do what so many can’t, “Ask questions, and still manage to believe in something, whatever it is.”

By: annegb

annegb — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 15:38:37 +0000

God seems cruel. I was mad at Him for so long. Until last year I felt He wasn’t there for me, that He has favorites and I wasn’t one of them.

I’m not brimming with faith today, but I did learn last year about footsteps in the sand.

Seraphine, a good book that voiced a lot of what you’re talkign about, at least for me, is “Reaching For the Invisible God,” by Philip Yancey. In it, he speaks about many famous people of God who doubted. It’s very validating. Somewhere in there it makes the point that only those who truly love and seek God doubt Him.

I’ll have to try to find it. For me, it’s one day at a time. And God feels mostly punitive, even still.

By: Stephen M (Ethesis)

Stephen M (Ethesis) — Sat, 27 Jun 2009 18:47:14 +0000

I he had asked my advice, I would have instead suggested a Moroni 10:3 approach. Decide to marry you and ask God to let him know if it was a mistake. Then go ahead and get married unless God told him otherwise.

McConkie, who, bless his heart had some rough moments, gave a great talk on that sort of thing at BYU. Ah well, guys remain guys, my wife tells me it is part of our charm.

By: Camille

Camille — Fri, 26 Jun 2009 22:01:28 +0000

Seraphine,
From my personal experience I want to attest to you that God is not cruel. He loves us so dearly. I think when we pray about something he does confirm if it is good, if the possibility can be good. My good friend prayed about marrying her husband, she felt at peace and they were married. 10 years later with three kids in tow, he had an affair and left her. Why would Heavenly Father confirm to her this marriage if he knew what the final outcome would be. Wouldn’t it have saved her heartache if she was answered differently? (my opinion only) I feel as Heavenly Father sees all the potentials in life. He knows in the end what all the outcomes will be but I feel that he knows all the potentials that life has to offer, he knows us from the beginning of earth and what choices we made. My friend was probably answered in the affirmative to marry her sweetheart because he had the potential of being great. If God answered her no, not to marry him because He knew how the outcome would turn out, He would be taking away the free agency of her future husband-to cheat or not to cheat. Your affirmation prayer might have meant that this marriage could have had the potential to be a good marriage, you were presented that confirmation, you presented your witness to him-but because of that gift of free agency your boyfriend didn’t accept. I hope that all made sense, I don’t even know if that all made sense..but I want to testify that I know Heavenly Father loves you and wants you to be happy. I hope you can find the peace you so long for.

By: Seraphine

Seraphine — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:50:31 +0000

Stephen, you’re right that I’m only telling one side of the story. I’ve tried not to share too many details about him and what happened because I want to respect his privacy, and I don’t really need or want feedback from others on what happened between us. Here’s a very brief summary, though: he took my witness seriously, but in the end, he couldn’t make a commitment he wasn’t ready to make without his own spiritual confirmation. (Which I totally agree with.)

While this was difficult for me, it’s something I can accept and deal with. What I’m really struggling with is God’s involvement in the whole situation.

By: Seraphine

Seraphine — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 17:38:42 +0000

crazywomancreek, that’s a great poem–thanks for sharing.

Carol, that sounds like a really difficult situation. I’m glad that you have been able to find peace. I believe that I will eventually find peace as well–I’m just not sure yet how it will come.

By: Stephen M (Ethesis)

Stephen M (Ethesis) — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 00:00:04 +0000

I don’t want to pry, but with the details we have (you had a confirmation that you would successfully get together with a guy, now he has bailed on the relationship) I’m curious what the guy had to say as he left and what his feelings were about your witness.

You don’t have to answer, and it probably doesn’t make a difference, but it is kind of the missing part of the story.

By: Carol

Carol — Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:57:31 +0000

Life can be SO difficult, and sometimes when trials are so harsh and unrelenting, we may feel betrayed by God. Since my daughter has been tortured and raped by a trusted friend, my life has spiraled into hating myself (for placing my daughter in a situation where she was violated), hating the perpetrator, and feeling anger at God for allowing such suffering. I have spiraled into a clinical depression which has been life-threatening at times.

I have struggled with more issues that I can write about, but have held on to my love of Jesus Christ, who I know understands my pain when no one else seems to. I have learned things about Him I would not have learned in any other way and find solace in blogging about these spiritual discoveries. I still suffer but can now experience peace amid sorrow.

May God comfort you during this difficult time, and please know that even though I do not know you personally, I do care about you and feel your pain.

By: Stephen M (Ethesis)

Stephen M (Ethesis) — Sat, 20 Jun 2009 04:35:15 +0000

I’m not considering leaving the church because the church because God has betrayed my trust through the institution. Instead, I’m considering leaving the church because God has betrayed my trust (from my perspective) in my direct, prayerful interactions with Him. And I can’t be okay with institutional stuff if I’m not okay with God one-on-one.

The one time I really had trouble with the Church the reason I was upset with the Church was because it was true and because I was upset with God. It was a hard place until things unwound for me. But I’ve had a couple three times where things looked like I had been betrayed until they unwound (kind of like one of those tangled knot tricks where with just the right pull it all comes straight).

I now expect that out of God, but the first few times through were really, really painful.

All I can say is bless your heart. It is rough.

By: crazywomancreek

crazywomancreek — Sat, 20 Jun 2009 00:30:52 +0000

Starfoxy and Seraphine, if you don’t already know it, this is a poem that I’ve always loved; I know you meant “eat” in a different way but I couldn’t help but think of it:

God the Eater
by Stevie Smith
There is a god in whom I do not believe
Yet to this god my love stretches,
This god whom I do not believe in is
My whole life, my life and I am his.
Everything that I have of pleasure and pain
(Of pain, of bitter pain and men’s contempt)
I give this god for him to feed upon
And he is my whole life and I am his.
When I am dead I hope that he will eat
Everything I have been and have not been
And crunch and feed upon it and grow fat
Eating my life all up as it is his.
1957.