Comments on: The Trouble with Chicken Patriarchy http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/ Sun, 20 May 2012 23:04:59 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Chicken Patriarchy by Caroline Kline « Feminism and Religion http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-68572 Chicken Patriarchy by Caroline Kline « Feminism and Religion Mon, 16 Jan 2012 11:01:42 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-68572 [...] of the most powerful and frequently cited Mormon feminist blog posts, Kiskilili’s “The Trouble With Chicken Patriarchy” on Zelophehad’s Daughters discusses the strange brand of patriarchy Mormons contend [...] [...] of the most powerful and frequently cited Mormon feminist blog posts, Kiskilili’s “The Trouble With Chicken Patriarchy” on Zelophehad’s Daughters discusses the strange brand of patriarchy Mormons contend [...]

]]> By: Mormonism’s Chicken Patriarchy | Main Street Plaza http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-66866 Mormonism’s Chicken Patriarchy | Main Street Plaza Tue, 23 Aug 2011 08:47:39 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-66866 [...] didn’t used to be so chicken-like.  As a 2007 post from Zelophehad’s Daughters explains, back in the 1970s, Church leaders were blatantly patriarchal.  Consider this excerpt [...] [...] didn’t used to be so chicken-like.  As a 2007 post from Zelophehad’s Daughters explains, back in the 1970s, Church leaders were blatantly patriarchal.  Consider this excerpt [...]

]]> By: Lynnette http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-65761 Lynnette Sat, 18 Jun 2011 07:56:54 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-65761 Merriwyn, you might find this post of interest: http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2011/04/29/what-does-hearken-mean/ Merriwyn, you might find this post of interest:

http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2011/04/29/what-does-hearken-mean/

]]> By: Merriwyn http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-65760 Merriwyn Sat, 18 Jun 2011 07:47:47 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-65760 <blockquote>Sorry to play my broken record on this issue, but my problem is I don’t feel I can adopt that position and still, in good faith, commit to God that I will hearken to my husband’s counsel as he hearkens to God’s, which is why I felt I had to have those covenants annulled as a way of coming clean to God and refusing to lie about how I intend to behave.</blockquote> Hearken means listen ;) I can listen ;) no-one said anything about obeying ;) Works for me ;) Ps I promise I'll come back & read the rest of the comments later ;) & no doubt comment on the general issue more

Sorry to play my broken record on this issue, but my problem is I don’t feel I can adopt that position and still, in good faith, commit to God that I will hearken to my husband’s counsel as he hearkens to God’s, which is why I felt I had to have those covenants annulled as a way of coming clean to God and refusing to lie about how I intend to behave.

Hearken means listen ;) I can listen ;) no-one said anything about obeying ;)
Works for me ;)

Ps I promise I’ll come back & read the rest of the comments later ;) & no doubt comment on the general issue more

]]> By: Strong Man http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-62603 Strong Man Thu, 24 Feb 2011 18:48:31 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-62603 This confusion drove me to launch my blog. You're right--it's very confusing. Just read the comments on Mormon.org about the roles of men and women in marriage--it's a jumble of confusion. I've tried to explain the contradictions in my post: <a> Preside vs. Equal Partners </a> Essentially, the only way I can realistically explain the two is that preside means the person who is in charge but equal refers to importance, value in the sight of God, and not to authority. You can't have one person presiding and still have two people equal in authority. They can however, be equal in lots of other ways. This confusion drove me to launch my blog. You’re right–it’s very confusing. Just read the comments on Mormon.org about the roles of men and women in marriage–it’s a jumble of confusion.

I’ve tried to explain the contradictions in my post: Preside vs. Equal Partners

Essentially, the only way I can realistically explain the two is that preside means the person who is in charge but equal refers to importance, value in the sight of God, and not to authority.

You can’t have one person presiding and still have two people equal in authority. They can however, be equal in lots of other ways.

]]> By: Elections and Spouses | http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-60875 Elections and Spouses | Mon, 08 Nov 2010 18:33:58 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-60875 [...] same page” when voting. I am pretty sensitive to gendered relationships in marriages, who has the spoken (or unspoken) right to the last word and who is seen as having more authority and expertise in the [...] [...] same page” when voting. I am pretty sensitive to gendered relationships in marriages, who has the spoken (or unspoken) right to the last word and who is seen as having more authority and expertise in the [...]

]]> By: Mark Brown http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57641 Mark Brown Sat, 30 Jan 2010 22:51:55 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57641 But Jack, don't you see? That approach solves nothing. If the kids are going to grow up with Led Zeppelin, all it means is that they are gonna get a whole lotta love, which is what the new presiding means, right? But Jack, don’t you see? That approach solves nothing. If the kids are going to grow up with Led Zeppelin, all it means is that they are gonna get a whole lotta love, which is what the new presiding means, right?

]]> By: Ms. Jack Meyers http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57638 Ms. Jack Meyers Sat, 30 Jan 2010 21:13:45 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57638 Like I said <a href="http://www.nine-moons.com/2010/01/26/make-me-a-sandwich-woman-i-mean-please/#comment-96173" rel="nofollow">over at 9M</a>, if we're going to redefine "preside" so that it means things that LDS leaders never intended it to mean, I'm going with BrianJ's definition of "preside": “In my house, I take ‘preside’ to mean ‘make sure your daughters grow up with Led Zeppelin.’ Now, you can argue whether that’s really what ‘preside’ means, but seeing that I preside in my house, I get to choose the definitions.” Like I said over at 9M, if we’re going to redefine “preside” so that it means things that LDS leaders never intended it to mean, I’m going with BrianJ’s definition of “preside”: “In my house, I take ‘preside’ to mean ‘make sure your daughters grow up with Led Zeppelin.’ Now, you can argue whether that’s really what ‘preside’ means, but seeing that I preside in my house, I get to choose the definitions.”

]]> By: Kiskilili http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57636 Kiskilili Sat, 30 Jan 2010 17:19:50 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57636 In other words, it makes no difference who presides--since presiding doesn't entail any power anyway--as long as it's men. But it would be sacrilegious to try to understand this nonsensical situation. In other words, it makes no difference who presides–since presiding doesn’t entail any power anyway–as long as it’s men. But it would be sacrilegious to try to understand this nonsensical situation.

]]> By: Rich Alger http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57631 Rich Alger Fri, 29 Jan 2010 18:54:54 +0000 http://zelophehadsdaughters.com/2007/11/30/the-trouble-with-chicken-patriarchy/#comment-57631 I read most of this post after being directed here by the <a href="http://www.clobberblog.com" rel="nofollow">sideblog</a> of Jack Meyers, "Oh, hello again, chicken patriarchy. Nice to know you still care." She was commenting on <a href="http://www.nine-moons.com/2010/01/26/make-me-a-sandwich-woman-i-mean-please/" rel="nofollow">Make Me A Sandwich, Woman! I Mean Please</a>. This post makes much more sense to me. What importance is there who presides as long as they preside in the way the Lord wants them to. I do not pretend to understand why it is the way it is. The post of Rusty just makes more sense to me logically and through nearly 15 years of marriage practice. When we are both striving to live according to the Spirit, that is when we have unity. We yield to the enticings of the Holy Spirit not to the ego of a human. I read most of this post after being directed here by the sideblog of Jack Meyers, “Oh, hello again, chicken patriarchy. Nice to know you still care.”

She was commenting on Make Me A Sandwich, Woman! I Mean Please. This post makes much more sense to me. What importance is there who presides as long as they preside in the way the Lord wants them to. I do not pretend to understand why it is the way it is. The post of Rusty just makes more sense to me logically and through nearly 15 years of marriage practice.

When we are both striving to live according to the Spirit, that is when we have unity. We yield to the enticings of the Holy Spirit not to the ego of a human.

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