Comments on: Romanticizing the Reformation

By: Chris

Chris — Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:11:05 +0000

Thanks!

By: Lynnette

Lynnette — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 16:47:04 +0000

Sorry for the slow response, but if you’re still around (or anyone else is interested in this topic), one place to start might be with Grell & Scribner’s book of essays, Tolerance and Intolerance in the European Reformation.

By: Chris

Chris — Wed, 30 Jan 2008 20:51:57 +0000

I know this thread is kind of old, but I’d like to read the historians you (Lynnette) mentioned who argue that the Reformation pushed religious tolerance backwards. Can you give me any citations?

By: Fideline

Fideline — Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:45:30 +0000

As I medievalist, I’ll suggest a medieval figure Mormons should read: Gregory the Great, the sixth-century monk turned pope. He was not a groundbreaking theologian, but he advocated a missiological program with great cultural sensitivity, and he wrote insightfully about the difficulties of simultaneously maintaining a meditative spirituality while serving in demanding public offices. Many Mormons would find his book, The Pastoral Care, written as a guide for ecclesiastical leadership, very similiar to many talks given in General Conference.

By: Juvenile Instructor » From the Archives: John Wesley, the Latter-day Saint

Juvenile Instructor » From the Archives: John Wesley, the Latter-day Saint — Wed, 14 Nov 2007 02:19:42 +0000

[...] Mormons, it seems, are quite fond of ”romanticizing the Reformation,” meaning that Mormons often portray Luther, Arminius, and other Protestant Reformers as [...]

By: From the Archives: John Wesley, the Latter-day Saint « Juvenile Instructor

From the Archives: John Wesley, the Latter-day Saint « Juvenile Instructor — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 01:29:01 +0000

[...] 19th-century Mormonism, Archives, Christopher Modern Mormons, it seems, are quite fond of ”romanticizing the Reformation,” meaning that Mormons often portray Luther, Arminius, and other Protestant Reformers as [...]

By: john f.

john f. — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 11:57:18 +0000

But I’ll be the first to admit there are probably some real holes in that argument.

I sure hope so.

By: Seth R.

Seth R. — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 04:52:58 +0000

Lynnette, I think it’s a bit different today.

My own personal opinion is that modern Mormons do it by siding up with the Christian Right in bashing gays, poor people, and Democrats, But I’ll be the first to admit there are probably some real holes in that argument.

By: Lynnette

Lynnette — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 23:23:47 +0000

Seth, that underdog syndrome you mention is such an interesting dynamic; I’m wondering what forms it might take in a contemporary context. (Mormons distancing themselves from Scientologists? “Sure we’re weird, but at least we don’t believe in Xenu.”)

Kaimi, good points. I think you’re right about the Reformation being valued for producing a context which made the Restoration possible (though I think RT’s question about the role of Enlightenment is a fascinating one). But I think it’s more than that; it’s also the appeal of the romantic narrative of the courageous individual who resists the oppressive institution. And that kind of narrative is one which reflects American cultural ideals, I would argue, at least as much as specifically Mormon ones.

By: Kaimi

Kaimi — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 18:24:36 +0000

Wow, Lynnette. I really like your Catholic-Protestant belief breakdown — I’ve never put those pieces together quite like that. “When it comes to the religious questions at stake, it seems to me that we overwhelmingly side with the Catholics.” Really interesting point.

As for Luther and the September Six, you’re right to note that, to an outside observer, they do look pretty similar.

A few potential differences to an LDS viewer:

First, Luther recognized the apostasy. Thus, he becomes a sort of proto-Joseph Smith. Breaking ground, if you will, for the idea that the Catholic church was wrong.

Second, the Reformation set the stage for Joseph Smith. For example, it changed the way that scripture was read, and those changes permitted Joseph Smith to exist. Without the reformation, it’s unlikely that Joseph would have had the ability to form his church. Absent Luther, could the LDS church have even existed?

I think that Luther is praised not because the Reformation is viewed as right or correct, but because it is viewed (correctly, I think) as a structural prerequisite for the Restoration.

On the other hand, there is more recognition of good pre-Reformation things in different places. That more nuanced view of medieval times is a good thing.